My girlfriend worked as a weaving technician and she said the H&M stuff got much worse over the past decade and subjectively it is true. The stuff literally disintegrates if you have it in the drier to often. Sadly enough this is also true for the men’s wear.
I certainly try to spend a little more and get quality stuff. Second hand stores can also be great because you can find great quality stuff that feels better after the 20th wash than the H&M stuff feels fresh out of the store.
> The stuff literally disintegrates if you have it in the drier to often. Sadly enough this is also true for the men’s wear.
H&M stuff for me never tears or gets holes. Mine just stretches in places where it shouldn't stretch (eg. T-shirt sleeves - how the hell do those stretch?! I don't have steroid-monster arms. I have a <1 year old t-shirt where I can put my whole head through the sleeve (usually by accident), and there's still some space left, and i remember it was fitted well when new... So yeah, it's my 'yard work' shirt. ).
Depends on the time scale. H&M shirts I have are extremely thinned out over the years compared to other shirts I have since more than a decade. I cannot eliminate the possibility that the quality varies with the area where they sell it (I am in Europe).
Well apparently women are supposed to only wear a piece of clothing once or twice, no? So they optimize for price, so you can buy more pieces of clothing so you have something to wear, rather than longevity which "nobody" cares about.
That said, it's not just the clothes for women. I tried buying some jeans at H&M, twice. Both times I wore a hole in them in less than a month. I'm not doing anything special, just a regular office guy. I usually buy Diesel jeans and they last at least a couple of years each.
> Well apparently women are supposed to only wear a piece of clothing once or twice, no?
Unfortunately, yes. This is what tends to happen. My wife complains about how this is so much the case in women's fashion. Fashion is designed to encourage consumption. People buy new clothes, new appliances, etc just because of color and style. This drives cheaply made products, since they aren't going to last long anyway.
Really wish we could move away from this and get back to quality products that last. But, until people get past fashion, I can't expect this will happen.
To what extent do studies or indices or whatever indicating that prices of goods have dropped under liberal economic & trade policies of the last few decades factor in quality of same goods? I'm not sure decent goods have actually dropped in price, and wouldn't be surprised if some have in fact become more expensive, and suspect that extremely crappy goods that didn't exist at all before account for much of the alleged reduction in prices.
Maybe, maybe not. The longer-lasting but expensive stuff might not be available in styles you like, for instance. So, for example, what good is a long-lasting shirt if it looks like something only your grandfather would wear?
People are never going to "get past fashion". People who have any money at all have been worried about fashion for millennia now. The only people who didn't were people too poor to do anything but worry about keeping themselves clothed with whatever they could find.
The outfits from these places are almost always based on designs from more expensive fashion designers. I would be surprised if you couldn't find an equivalent or nicer made with first world labor and nicer materials. However I would not be surprised if it cost literally 50x more than an HM equivalent.
Most brands, especially the low priced ones has reduced the quality of the weaving and textiles, and that contributes to the fast fashion. Your sweater stretches a bit and you go buy a new one (or so they think). I remember I had bought some sweaters in the late 90s from Topman in the UK and they looked brand new 7 years later. Now, nothing from Topman is nearly as good.
Now though I stick to brands such as COS, yes they do cost x5 or X10 what H&M costs, but the difference in the clothe is evident.
This is interested. About 20 years ago I bought a few Vans button-up shirts. These were amazing garments with vents in all the right areas. I'm not a skater but I understand why the shirts were designed the way they were. They were functional fashion. I wore one of these shirts for 10+ years and when it finally wore out, I was sad to find out that Vans carried nothing like it any more. I tried some other Vans shirts but they felt like more fashion than utility.
I expect durability when I spend a lot of money. I own five Patagonia shirts that are all 10+ years old and still look and feel like brand new. I love how I can turn the garments into my local Patagonia retailer when they reach end-of-life.
I once wore a Calvin Klein tee for 15+ years until it disintegrated. That shirt was soooooo comfy! I didn't want to throw it away, but my wife complained how horrible it looked even when I was reduced to only wearing it inside the house!
>Now though I stick to brands such as COS, yes they do cost x5 or X10 what H&M costs, but the difference in the clothe is evident.
Yeah, but do they really last 5-10 times as long? If not, then from a purely economic point-of-view, they're not as good a deal. Spending 10x as much for something that lasts 2x as long really doesn't make economic sense: you can buy 2 of the cheaper thing and still spend 1/5 as much money.
What are you talking about? It doesn't take any more time to buy 2 shirts than to buy 1 shirt. Maybe it adds an extra 5 seconds at the cash register, but that's not significant.
It is true buying clothes in bulk would never have entered my mind. One thing stand I have really bad experience with clothes, they break in the most awkard times, cheap clothes does that all the time in my experience. I still have my very high quality jacket I bought in 1995, it takes a beating holds up and is easily fixed.
Where are you getting your clothes? I have some pretty cheap shirts and I've never had one "break in the most awkward time". They just start developing holes, especially on the collar.
I don't need or buy nearly as many of the standard business casual outfits as I used to when I went into an office regularly. (Things have gotten even more casual at conferences etc. as well.)
But I've found a number of my go to mail order catalog places that I used to order from like clockwork have really gone downhill over time. I still buy from them sometimes but the quality definitely isn't what it used to be.
I'm not sure if my memory serves me right, but my impression was that most of their clothing was made in Portugal when they were in a few flagship stores only. Once they scaled their production to a worldwide online shop, more things were made in countries like Bangladesh or China. I felt like this blurred the line between them and the cheaper H&M Premium Quality stuff.
I have similar experiences with H&M, and a lot of other cheap basically colored shirts. It’ll feel great at first. Then I’ll leave it in the dryer for a few minutes too long, and the fit completely changes while the material looks degraded.
I’m more than happy to spend $30+ on a simple shirt that won’t change its fit after a few cleanings, but struggle to find a consistent brand.
If anyone has recommendations, please let me know.
> I have similar experiences with H&M, and a lot of other cheap basically colored shirts. It’ll feel great at first. Then I’ll leave it in the dryer for a few minutes too long, and the fit completely changes while the material looks degraded.
Hang dry and use a lower spin speed in the wash. It takes a little more planning and time, but I hang dry almost all my clothes and I have t-shirts from H&M type store that are 8 years old and still holding up. Some higher quality clothes brands are even older and look pretty much brand new.
I can get clothing to last until the fabric actually wears out - elbows in dress shirts, knees in pants etc and even after that you can sometimes convert them to shorts with a little sewing.
Style is rather personal but for reasonably long lasting clothing without extreme prices.
Patagonia or other backpacking suppliers or mid ranged department stores between Macy’s and Nordstroms. The next rung up for most brands aka Banana Republic > GAP can be hit or miss, but you really need to give up on low end stores.
That said quality is visible when you’re buying. Ultra thin cloth just can’t last.
> I’m more than happy to spend $30+ on a simple shirt that won’t change its fit after a few cleanings, but struggle to find a consistent brand.
Yes I face this problem as well. It seems that no matter how much you pay, you get the same clothes manufactured in the same sweatshops but you pay extra for a "better" logo/brand.
I like Zara, but it is debatable if they actually do have better quality for the higher prices they ask for.
I actually really like Goodfellow & Co. (Target's clothing brand).
The men's clothing are on the cheaper side but still feel like decent materials. I mostly just have t-shirts and a few polos. The t-shirts have lasted at least a couple years so far and have gone through many washes.
Most of the styles are nothing to write home about, but if you just want a simple shirt that looks decent and doesn't fall apart, I've had good luck. I think it might be US-only being that it's Target?
For pants, I've put a couple pairs of Lucky Brand jeans through hell and back and they barely show any wear. I'm sure there are more durable ones out there, but these are by far my favorites.
For jackets, it's either Goodfellow & Co. again or a couple of Polo Ralph Lauren zippered jackets that I got for a good deal secondhand. They are soft and feel like they'll last a good while.
This whole comment feels like an ad, but you did ask for brand recommendations. I'm sure someone will tell me how H&M or F21 either owns all of these or use the same factories. I've at least had good luck with them.
I personally can see how H&M quality went down in last 10 years. Around 10 years ago it was decent quality for reasonable price, not it's just things I'd avoid even touching.
I would say their quality improved. For example, 10 years ago their t-shirts were really thin with skewed cuts that became evident once you tried to fold them. Now the t-shirts are made of much thicker cotton and the cutting follows a proper pattern.
I certainly try to spend a little more and get quality stuff. Second hand stores can also be great because you can find great quality stuff that feels better after the 20th wash than the H&M stuff feels fresh out of the store.